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JackH
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· 06/05/2020 5:38 PM
peveleth, It is better if you start a post in the forum with your question. These shouts go away in time.

peveleth
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· 06/05/2020 3:10 PM
For Gene Cafe Roasters I have an older Gene Cafe Roaster. Temp fluctuates probably showing age. Question: For recent owners of the newer Gene Cafe Roaster, your opinions?

her63
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· 06/02/2020 9:10 AM
keep healthy bro, love roaster form home

pisanoal
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· 05/27/2020 10:14 AM
Anyone else have issues seeing the whole window of a thread when accessing from a mobile phone? Any fixes?

allenb
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· 04/02/2020 4:50 AM
Morning Ed, I haven't done any green coffee hoarding yet but am hoping the supplies don't end up like the toilet paper isles!

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Flour sifter agitators stuck on beans
mtbizzle
Just tried a test run of a flour sifter / popper roaster, and unfortunately beans got stuck on the agitators of the flour sifter several times per rotation. Not really operable until I find a solution. I'm a little surprised, as flour sifter roasters are so common but I haven't heard of this problem very much. I saw in another thread that one person bent the agitators a lot, which prevented stuck beans. Are there other solutions, or is this the standard way to fix this problem? pouring

images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/9113GlMTnUL._AC_SL1500_.jpg
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
Koffee Kosmo
Use a spring ( about 4mm dia ) to go over the wire sections that spin

KK
I home roast and I like it
Blog - http://koffeekosmo.blogspot.com/
Bezzera Strega: Mazzer Robur Grinder: 5 Box hand grinders: Pullman Tamper Convex: (KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster: CONA Glass Rod Syphon: Pyrex Brewer:
 
http://koffeekosmo.com.au
allenb

Quote

Koffee Kosmo wrote:

Use a spring ( about 4mm dia ) to go over the wire sections that spin

KK


This may work but I think one of the issues with a sifter is this. As the curved rods rotate toward the screen, the clearance between the rods and the structure decrease to the point where the beans get hung up in between and bind. I had that occur when I experimented with it years ago and seemed to be a tough one to get around. Maybe raising the rotating element up a bit and installing the springs would allow a less rigid wiping action and prevent binding?
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
Koffee Kosmo

Quote

allenb wrote:
This may work but I think one of the issues with a sifter is this. As the curved rods rotate toward the screen, the clearance between the rods and the structure decrease to the point where the beans get hung up in between and bind. I had that occur when I experimented with it years ago and seemed to be a tough one to get around. Maybe raising the rotating element up a bit and installing the springs would allow a less rigid wiping action and prevent binding?


That is correct
I had a similar agitator and bean binding issue and solved it with the addition of springs

KK
I home roast and I like it
Blog - http://koffeekosmo.blogspot.com/
Bezzera Strega: Mazzer Robur Grinder: 5 Box hand grinders: Pullman Tamper Convex: (KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster: CONA Glass Rod Syphon: Pyrex Brewer:
 
http://koffeekosmo.com.au
mtbizzle
thumbdown I took the flour sifter apart a few times this morning, didn't really do much of anything, just brainstorming.

Unfortunately, now the sifter does not work. Rotating the handle/axle causes very little, if any, movement of the agitator.

Video here - https://i.giphy.com/media/cPm30gq611B.../giphy.mp4

With any beans in, it does not move at all. thumbdown What a bummer. I had two sifter roasters planned, parts all ordered.

If anyone has thoughts, I'm all ears -- spent the rest of my roaster budget on these parts. I'm guessing there is not enough contact between the axle and the agitator, so the axle turns but the agitator doesn't. I'm not sure I see a way to change that though.
Edited by mtbizzle on 05/14/2020 12:59 PM
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
renatoa
What kind of collars are you using for agitator ?
Are they part of the original sifter, or a DIY job ?
I would drill a hole in the collar, thread it and use an imbus screw to secure the collar to the axle.
As are this pieces:
http://www.valuehobby.com/5mm-wheel-c...ollar.html
 
mtbizzle

Quote

renatoa wrote:

What kind of collars are you using for agitator ?
Are they part of the original sifter, or a DIY job ?
I would drill a hole in the collar, thread it and use an imbus screw to secure the collar to the axle.
As are this pieces:
http://www.valuehobby.com/5mm-wheel-c...ollar.html


Hey Renatoa --

I fixed the issue of the agitator not rotating. This is what I am using now (both of the nuts are DIY/added):
i.imgur.com/P2lTmef.jpg

But... Back to square 1. It will turn, but beans get stuck, constantly. It does not work to agitate the beans.

See this video (turn audio on) -- https://i.imgur.com/WcMabAd.mp4

It seems that beans are often getting stuck against the wall, like this:
i.imgur.com/lFBFGRs.jpg
.. so I'm not sure that KK's suggestion of springs to pull down the mesh screen will resolve the problem thumbdown

Others have suggested spinning fast, and spinning in reverse to loosen the beans and present sticks. I can't seem to spin fast because of stuck beans. Spinning in reverse does seem to clear the stuck bean, but having to do this multiple times per turn, it is not an effective way to agitate... BBQ grill
Edited by mtbizzle on 05/14/2020 6:17 PM
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
JackH
I think KK was suggesting to get springs large enough to slip over the metal arms of the agitator. I did this with my early turbo roaster and it helped. I got them from McMaster-Carr and I think they were stainless.

The photo below was from 2011 when I built my first roaster. I used stainless steel welding rod with stainless steel springs over it. The added springs kept the beans from getting stuck under the paddles.
JackH attached the following image:
stiring_paddles2_1.jpg

Edited by JackH on 05/14/2020 6:51 PM
---Jack

KKTO Roaster.
 
mtbizzle

Quote

JackH wrote:

I think KK was suggesting to get springs large enough to slip over the metal arms of the agitator. I did this with my early turbo roaster and it helped. I got them from McMaster-Carr and I think they were stainless.

The photo below was from 2011 when I built my first roaster. I used stainless steel welding rod with stainless steel springs over it. The added springs kept the beans from getting stuck under the paddles.


I'm afraid I don't understand where the springs are supposed to be. Where are they supposed to attach to? The rounded arms of the agitator, that rotate?
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
Gullygossner
The suggestion would be to wrap the half circle arms of the agitator, I roughly sketched over the areas recommended to wrap with a spring. The springs allow for some forgiveness between the mesh and the agitation arms.

https://imgur.com/a/5zUMSzr
Edited by JackH on 05/15/2020 3:17 AM
 
Mbb
Looks like there's a lip there at the rim which catches beans?

If that is the case, can it be hammered flat all the way around?
 
mtbizzle

Quote

Gullygossner wrote:

The suggestion would be to wrap the half circle arms of the agitator, I roughly sketched over the areas recommended to wrap with a spring. The springs allow for some forgiveness between the mesh and the agitation arms.

https://imgur.com/a/5zUMSzr


Oh! I see. Re-reading KK's post, that makes sense, my interpretation was way off. Is the idea to decrease the gap between agitator wires & wall/mesh of the sifter... so that beans can't fit into the space, and get stuck? My worry would be too much contact w/ the screen -- is that not an issue? I will definitely try this, though I'm not sure where to find a spring like this. Home depot only has things like heavy duty extension springs.

Quote

Looks like there's a lip there at the rim which catches beans?


Yes! That is definitely part of the problem.

Quote

If that is the case, can it be hammered flat all the way around?


Hmm I'll investigate. Looking at it, I don't see why not, but frankly it's a little hard for me to judge. That lip is the joint between the cylinder and the mesh at the bottom of the sifter, honestly no clue if hammering it might cause an issue with the joint.

Thanks all for your help/suggestions!
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
Koffee Kosmo
Sorry for the late reply

The spring goes over the whole wire

This is how I solved the same issue with a slightly different agitator

i.postimg.cc/SYhVW7RW/F52ADAAE-CDC3-4400-95DE-7AF7244451D3.jpg

KK
I home roast and I like it
Blog - http://koffeekosmo.blogspot.com/
Bezzera Strega: Mazzer Robur Grinder: 5 Box hand grinders: Pullman Tamper Convex: (KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster: CONA Glass Rod Syphon: Pyrex Brewer:
 
http://koffeekosmo.com.au
mtbizzle
Huh, I think I see --- extension springs attached to agitator arms that are across from each other. Pulling the arms/wires together some. I was able to bend the agitator wires, at the advice of other folks. It's ugly, but works better. Beans still get stuck frequently.

Given all the issues, I tried to make paddles as per here - i0.wp.com/makezine.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Flour-Sifter-Coffee-Roaster-Fig-W.jpg
This is from the make magazine guide for Larry Cotton's HG/FS roaster.

Edit: Found success today w/ the paddles. Was having difficulty drilling holes in the aluminum. Sanded, filed, and secured with lock washers/nuts.
Edited by mtbizzle on 05/18/2020 6:15 PM
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
mtbizzle
Got it rollin' with some persistence and help. Some concern that lock washers + nuts may not keep the paddles in place over time, but I figure I can adjust positioning after roasts.

Did first roast today using the 5 cup sifter atop a Poppery II.

Used 135 of natural yirgacheffe that I have had difficulty roasting well (it is grade 4). Typically quite uneven.

135g of natural yirgacheffe in.
Dry stage seemed quite uneven, and I could tell the roast was taking too long. Dry end around 7 min.
No cracks for quite some time. I put the Poppery II lid on top of the sifter to retain heat. Still no cracks at about 16:30, so I dumped the beans into the popper.
1C began shortly thereafter, and was quite short. About 1:20.
Drop not long after 1C end (we're talking upwards of 19min at this point).
116g out, 14% loss.

i.imgur.com/JIzvG8e.jpg

I picked out a few defects prior to roast, and removed about 50 quakers / underroasted beans.
As mentioned above, it always seems to come out quite uneven, looking much like this.

I'm guessing this is going to be baked, no good, due to stalling out in the mid phase.

Clearly I need to increase max temps inside the sifter. Ideas include:

-Use my stainless steel funnel atop the sifter to retain heat.
-Remove the fan speed controller (had the popper wired through it, but had it at full power).
-Maybe apply foil tape to outside of sifter.
-Would increasing charge size retain more heat? Have heard conflicting things.

Any other ideas? I hear flour sifter popper builds used to be a thing, discussed back on Sweet Maria's forum.
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
Gullygossner

Quote

mtbizzle wrote:

135g of natural yirgacheffe in.
Dry stage seemed quite uneven, and I could tell the roast was taking too long. Dry end around 7 min.
No cracks for quite some time. I put the Poppery II lid on top of the sifter to retain heat. Still no cracks at about 16:30, so I dumped the beans into the popper.
1C began shortly thereafter, and was quite short. About 1:20.
Drop not long after 1C end (we're talking upwards of 19min at this point).
116g out, 14% loss.



This weekend I attempted to use a poppery 1 heat/fan unit as the heat source on my KKTO style setup. I had similar experience in not being able to achieve roasting temperature’s. I had a larger bean mass (600g) and have the outer shell of the roaster insulated using a towel.

10 min in I was just passed the yellowing stage and my trend line was far off anything that would be drinkable so I pulled the plug on that idea.

I suspect air poppers can’t achieve the same outlet temperatures as heat guns since the retention time over the heating coils is less and I suspect the airflow is higher.
 
mtbizzle

Quote


I wish the old Sweet maria's thread was still accessible. Wonder why it was removed. I've heard poppers were used with flour sifters, though. I'm sure it would be useful to hear what they did.

Was it a Homeroasters thread that was removed?
Edited by JackH on 05/19/2020 8:22 AM
Roast: Nostalgia popper
Grind: Comandante c40, Encore
Brew: v60, flair espresso, moka pot, french press, cezve w/ 'Scott Rao' water
Ask me about Tea!
 
renatoa

Quote

Gullygossner wrote:

This weekend I attempted to use a poppery 1 heat/fan unit as the heat source on my KKTO style setup.


Any chance to see a picture of this setup, you made me curious Grin

Judging strictly by numbers, 600 grams shouldn't be too much for 1200W of a typical popper... a full size TO do this job with 1300 W... but different heat transfer, indeed...
 
Gullygossner

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Quote

Gullygossner wrote:

This weekend I attempted to use a poppery 1 heat/fan unit as the heat source on my KKTO style setup.


Any chance to see a picture of this setup, you made me curious Grin

Judging strictly by numbers, 600 grams shouldn't be too much for 1200W of a typical popper... a full size TO do this job with 1300 W... but different heat transfer, indeed...


I believe the poppery 1 is 1500w so I figured it would have no problem supplying enough heat. I have torn the lid apart already to either modify it to fit a heat gun or allow the poppery 1 unit to sit lower in the lid, closer to the bean mass. I'll try to paint a picture of how it was setup though, stainless steel cut to fit over the kkto pots. One hole with a hinged lid for bean loading and viewing and another hole big enough for the poppery 1 with the plastic portion of the popcorn chamber removed, just the bottom fan section and metal mixing/heating element section bolted to the lid blowing in.
Gullygossner attached the following image:
8dc9b3c0-34f5-4834-93ab-3bc8fde10f26.jpeg
 
Gullygossner

Quote

mtbizzle wrote:

Quote


I wish the old Sweet maria's thread was still accessible. Wonder why it was removed. I've heard poppers were used with flour sifters, though. I'm sure it would be useful to hear what they did.

Was it a Homeroasters thread that was removed?


I believe this is the unit being refered to but I can't seem to get to the forum linked in the article.

https://legacy.sweetmarias.com/librar...os-aguayo/
Edited by JackH on 05/19/2020 1:01 PM
 
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