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CharcoalRoaster
11/04/2019 1:58 AM
+1 snwcmpr

snwcmpr
11/03/2019 2:16 AM
Can we make the shoutbox UNAVAILABLE until a member has a certain number of posts?

allenb
11/01/2019 2:20 AM
Funopt, please post in the gas and electric heat sources forum

Funopt
10/30/2019 5:17 AM
Can someone help me for using forced propane burner as my heating element. I rather want to use lpg than electric. Do you think it would work

snwcmpr
10/22/2019 5:31 AM
Thanks to you all....... I was not sleeping ... I stayed awake worried about it all. :)

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Fluid Bed Roaster Build - bye bye Heat Gun and Flour Sifter
renatoa
An alternative to SSR+ZCD is the ultra cheap dimmer from RobotDyn, containing both components in a single package.
It can be used in both modes, slow PWM or ZCD, as the application impose.
The 16 Amps switcher fitted on board is enough for any load in the 800W ballpark on 110V and 1400W on 220W. For more power all you need is to increase heatsink.
The combo is so efficient that I cleared my whole SSR stock and replaced with this board.
I mean this:
https://robotdyn....-110v.html
or from US eBay:
https://www.ebay....3292554114
 
jbrux4
greencardigan wrote:

In the downloads on Tindie there is a guide that shows some example ls for connection setups and other useful info such as code configuration options.


I reviewed the various configurations and info, but did I miss something regarding in parallel for elements?

greencardigan wrote:
If you are intending to control the blower speed using the TC4 then you will need the ZCD (I noticed the ZCD option wasn't included in your order).


I've realized that the ZCD is better bought through you instead of trying to figure out some comparable version. I've put the order in for the ZCD.

greencardigan wrote:
And regarding blower control. Many of us control the blower speed with the TC4 and the Artisan software but still with manual control rather than automatic. Automatic control would be possible but probably only if you roast the same beans with the same amount each time.


This is exactly what I want - options. I have two 10K potentiometers coming as well. The option to use a dial or use the software to control is great. I am sure that I will run into the same beans and weights to utilize the automated blower control - but I'll cross that blower automation bridge at some point.
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
renatoa wrote:

If current is 29 Amps, then you can get a 40A SSR, which is the most popular.
So popular that are faked copies in every shop that ask you a price less than $10 Grin


CK wrote:
To avoid wiring new circuits in your panel, or overloading the capacity of a single circuit, you could keep each element and blower separated. They can use their own circuits by using multiple extension cords input to the machine, each pulling from a different 15A breaker.

The heating circuits fire in tandem from the TC4 pulse to separate SSRs.


I plan on using Grainger for the SSRs. I know they won't be fakes and they are a couple miles up the road.

So, should I do separate SSRs for each element or do a higher amperage SSR?

renatoa wrote:
For this reason I would go with 230V, to reduce the current value and ease wiring.
Less current is best always when we want to reduce power losses.



I don't mind the wiring as long as I have a the right info to wire it up correctly. I can use the multiple extension cord
& breaker method. If I ever get to the point of modifying a breaker panel, that will be a real electrician to expand either 220 or 110 capacity to dedicated circuits. I am not in "my" house and am renting currently, so I don't want to invest or make something permanent here only to move out in a couple of years. I just like the fact that I can swap SSRs and wiring to suit whatever power options I have later.
Edited by jbrux4 on 11/02/2019 5:54 AM
R/
Jared
 
CK
Here's an image of how the transparent roaster is wired on 3 circuits. No issues whatsoever.
CK attached the following image:
wiring_image.jpg
 
CK
An image of the internal layout when installed.
CK attached the following image:
internal_layout.jpg
 
jbrux4
CK wrote:[/url]

An image of the internal layout when installed.

Here's an image of how the transparent roaster is wired on 3 circuits. No issues whatsoever.


Thanks CK. This provides some clarity for me. There is an additional cost for the additional SSR, but the way this is going, I might as well.

BTW - your build is so clean and inspiring.
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
IN-LINE HEATING ELEMENTS QUESTION:

Since I have decided to do the heating elements in parallel, each with their own SSR, I am now concerned with mounting the elements in-line in the heating tube.

I do have 12gauge high temp MG electrical power wire with mica sleeving and fiberglass overbraid to connect the elements from inside the tube to the outside of the tube. However, if the elements are in line, will the top element's terminals have too much exposure to heat? The elements are HAS-043K, 1750W, 14.5A, 110V. Both terminals for the element are located at the bottom of the element. As I understand it, the intent for the element in a heat gun is to have the terminals at the "cool" end of the element where the air flows past it taking the heat away from the terminals. With an element in line, essentially on top of the bottom element, those terminals will get a lot more heat. Am I risking terminal failure or melting if I do these in line? Any other risks here?

Pic of element: https://www.amazo...B015E6CTRG
Edited by jbrux4 on 11/04/2019 7:34 AM
R/
Jared
 
greencardigan
My opinion is that it will be easier to have the elements AND airflow in parallel. That's how I went with my builds.
 
jbrux4
greencardigan wrote:

My opinion is that it will be easier to have the elements AND airflow in parallel. That's how I went with my builds.


Thanks for your very qualified opinion.

I need the blower to get here before I see the options for a manifold or not. It is on the way.

I don't have a 3D printer to create a custom manifold though.

It is an option that I will definitely consider. But, do you think the in-line method is dangerous for the top element?
R/
Jared
 
greencardigan
I'm sure an in-line solution could be designed to work safely, I've just never seen it done or tried it myself.

I think the terminals on the element you linked to would be fine. It would be the wires connecting to them and any insulation on the wires. Somehow you'd have to keep the two wires electrically isolated and get them out through the element chamber which would presumably be made of metal.
 
jbrux4
I think I have a solution. I will replace the metal nuts with ceramic at the terminals. I will secure/house each element in a ceramic tube. Then, secure the tubes inside the pipe. There will be a gap between the elements to allow cable egress through a drilled port in the tube.

Elements will be conductive and thermally insulated as well.
R/
Jared
 
CK
jbrux4 wrote:

But, do you think the in-line method is dangerous for the top element?


Inline hasn't been a problem for my roaster. You can see how they are stacked in post #29
https://forum.hom...owstart=20
and #47
https://forum.hom...owstart=40

The top element and wire connection should only see 50% of the net heat value if the heaters have equal output, so at 250C ET the top element and wires shouldn't see more than about 125C. This hasn't been a problem for the high-temperature rated wires in the transparent roaster.
 
jbrux4
CK wrote:

Inline hasn't been a problem for my roaster.


I guess I am always looking for something more familiar to what mine will be using which is a SS 2" or 1.5" pipe. I have seen all of your pics and I personally would call that a sandwich because I think the elements, I think, are disc shaped and more layered. The same concept applies, and thanks for the explanation of the element utilization under a typical scenario.

The problem, I see, for my in-line pipe is the acquisition of an appropriate ceramic tube or mica tube. I would want a friction fit for the tube inside the pipe. Even if it was somewhat loose, I could use a set screw to prevent movement. I could then perform all heating element work outside of the heat pipe and then just slip it in. This will allow for ease of maintenance/replacement/modification in the future.

Ceramic seems expensive and less workable while Mica seems less expensive and easily workable - just need to find it in the right OD and thickness. As an added bonus, I will have a fire sleeve on the outside of the heat pipe as well to help insulate - and prevent forest fires.

It's coming together in my head - just need to get more pieces to start assembling.
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
To all,

I came to this site with an idea and a passion to build a roaster to simply get better coffee. I know that I am mostly clueless about a lot of what the experienced professionals and hobbyists have put into their roaster designs. My idea has take shape with a lot of research coupled with guidance from many. All of the help and information is much appreciated. And, because I know that I am a newbie and there are others trying to wrap their heads around it all, I will post my build sessions as episodes. This stuff may be rudimentary for some, but helpful to others. In addition, I am not trying to find and reuse parts to throw this thing together - though I admire those with the know-how and skills to do so - but, it's not just how I am doing this project. In the end, this thing will work, and this thing will last. I will get my use out of it and bring smiles, flavors, and aromas to many.

Though I have not completely decided on some design elements, the high level is this:
  1. Fluid-Bed that can do at least 600g
  2. Utilize SS and tri-clamp fittings where possible
  3. Dual 1750w, 14.5 Amp elements electrically wired in parallel on separate 110v circuits and physically mounted in-line in the heat pipe with a mica or ceramic tube for conductive and thermal insulation.
  4. Use at least 2 K-Type Thermocouples: (1) below the perf plate or screened gasket for air temp/environment temp (ET) and (2) in the top/outermost portion of the roast chamber reducer before the glass for the bean temp (BT).
  5. Utilize the TC4 to enable the capabilities of logging, monitoring, and controlling. Install potentiometers for the capability of manual control of heating and air flow.
  6. Use a thru-flow blower to heat the air prior to heat pipe entry. Also, insulate the outside of the heat pipe.
  7. Use a cyclone separator for chaff collection.
  8. Cabinet base for heat pipe and below. Exposed Roast Chamber and Chaff collector.
  9. Use an air intake silencer and employ other silencing techniques (i.e. roast chamber silicone jacket) if unable to hear first or second crack.
  10. Cool beans in chamber post roast and hopefully have enough power to eject with a slip in tube over the perf plat or gasket area.


To see my current partial BOM/procured items, see the attached file.
jbrux4 attached the following file:
partial_bom.7z [59Bytes / 12 Downloads]

R/
Jared
 
renatoa
The BT probe will measure anything, but not BT, in that location you want to place it.

Even if I try and still not understanding completely your 110V culture, in this specific case I don't understand why not connecting the two 110V heater elements in series, with a single SSR, to a 220V outlet, assuming such thing exist in almost all houses.

And the most personal preference... for 600 grams my experiments lead my way toward a turbo oven lid based build, after some 2-3 unsatisfactory FB contraptions.
It's a lot faster and simpler to build, and cheaper, to have a good roast from such setup, than from a FB, at this capacity, imo.
Sorry for this last paragraph rant, but the title of your thread triggered it Grin
 
jbrux4
The 220v is not convenient for me. There is one in the basement washer and dryer room. When I get back into "my house", I will gladly modify the panel and install outlets as needed. I may go back to Germany in a couple years and then switch the set-up to 220v. For my case, right now, 110v it is and will be, but the components can remain and I would only need to modify the plug input and possibly go in series with some cabling modification and a higher amperage SSR.

With the Ametek Blower stating a max CFM of 147 and the combined wattage of 3400-3500 watts, 600g is a low estimate, and I will most likely be able to get more.

Plus, with the build pieces, it all comes apart for modification down the road to upgrade and modify. These are sanitary tri clamp fittings and I can do whatever. I dont want multiple roasters, just one that can grow and change as needed.
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
renatoa wrote:

The BT probe will measure anything, but not BT, in that location you want to place it.


Please provide your recommendation on placement and why?
 
renatoa
Before this, maybe is a wrong understanding from my part, please explain more detailed where is this location:

in the top/outermost portion of the roast chamber reducer before the glass for the bean temp


Do you mean exhaust air temperature ?
 
renatoa
Rewiring the two 110V elements from paralel to series, and connecting them to 220V will not draw more current, conversely... you can use a lower current SSR.
 
jbrux4
renatoa wrote:

Do you mean exhaust air temperature ?


Negative. It will be at the top portion, the outer most diameter of the reducer that goes from heat pipes, to roast chamber.

Currently, I am thinking 1.5" heat pipe to 4" reducer (funnel). So, at the 4" part of the funnel. Above the funnel is the glass.
R/
Jared
 
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