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Koffee Kosmo
OfflineAdmin
· 08/12/2020 5:37 PM
And I thought it was just me that couldn't access the site All good now - coffee kept me company

JackH
OfflineAdmin
· 08/10/2020 8:46 PM
Had to make myself another cup of coffee to get through it.

snwcmpr
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· 08/10/2020 7:33 PM
I went into withdrawal for a bit. Now .. all is good. roar

mtbizzle
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· 08/10/2020 7:26 PM
Yeah Jack I think so, I couldn't access for a bit

JackH
OfflineAdmin
· 08/10/2020 6:51 PM
Did we lose the site for a while?

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Fluid Bed Roaster Build - bye bye Heat Gun and Flour Sifter
jbrux4

Quote

Husamka wrote:

I am thinking to buy ( 4" BOROSILICATE TRI CLAMP SIGHT GLASS WITH GASKETS AND TRI CLAMPS) its same like yours plus (two Hinge Tri Clamps and two Silicone Gaskets). do you recommend that or there is a reason that you ordered only the Tri Clamp sight glass without the clamps ?

https://shop.distillery-equipment.com/products/3-protected-borosilicate-tri-clamp-sight-glass-with-gaskets-and-tri-clamps-1?_pos=1&_sid=e3bad1f67&_ss=r


No particular reason. You should be just fine.
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
I've roasted 6 pounds so far, and I think I have my thermocouples figured out. They are off. Yep, that's it. They are off. How much you say? Enough to know that they are off. But, at least they are consistently off. I think my ET is to high while my BT is too low. But, at least I have BT sending a signal. After a few more roasts I may commit to an offset to put me more in the ball park I guess. Then I can actually attempt some automation - perhaps, at some point...

However, sight, sound, and smell work great - almost every time. I love this thing. It is awesome. So glad I fell down the rabbit hole AND drank the potion.
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
I have been coming up with a way to track what I have purchased, roasted, and sold. Yep, already selling!! The roasting data will get better when utilizing Artisan and/or Roastlogger - I'm just not there yet, so I built this out of necessity. I will continue to modify into the future, but it has helped me corral all that I have going on. My goal is to expand it to include a break even point which includes the cost of the roaster.

Maybe it could be of some use to others. It is attached.
jbrux4 attached the following file:
coffee_tracker.7z [24.02kB / 79 Downloads]

R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
The roaster build is taking a break. I am picking up and moving 1800 miles to work a diff job - same company though.

I recently got through an element and SSR issue: https://forum.homeroasters.org/forum/...post_70905

I spent a bit of time on a Break Even Analysis that turned into more of an accounting spreadsheet - it is still evolving. If you want to do a break even analysis, it is spot on - I think. So, if you are interested in seeing how long it would take to turn a profit, take a look. It does more, and I am not done with dynamic links either. I'll work on it more while I am not roasting.

None of the data in there is legit. It should be considered "dummy data" to show proof of concept.
jbrux4 attached the following file:
coffeetracker_v02xlsx.7z [158.57kB / 73 Downloads]

Edited by jbrux4 on 02/27/2020 9:41 PM
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
In a new location and in a new house. Luckily, there are 20A breakers and separate GFCI circuits near each other in the garage. There is a third circuit, non-gfci for the blower and electronics. I added a roast chamber extension and a curved exhaust at the top. The exhaust is undone obviously, but I do want it to get vented to outside. Since I am renting, I don't want to install a port hole outlet through the wall. Hopefully I buy in a year and make something more permanent. In the meantime, I may just wrap a mesh over it to catch the chaff.

I roasted two batches: (1) Yirgacheffe and an Organic Papua New Guinea A/X. I said what the heck and bought 50lb of the Yirg and 25lb. of the PNG. I love the cost per lb and no shortages at my house for the foreseeable future. Now, if I could only meet the neighbors....guess i'll have to wait a little bit before that.

Fluid Bed Roasting-Papua New Guinea 1lb at FC:

Fluid Bed Roaster Walk Around:
R/
Jared
 
CharcoalRoaster
Nice roast pouring

How do you dump beans? Do you have to completely disassemble?
Edited by JackH on 03/28/2020 2:56 PM
 
jbrux4

Quote

CharcoalRoaster wrote:

Nice roast pouring

How do you dump beans? Do you have to completely disassemble?


Let me answer the charge and discharge question.

To charge with the roast chamber extension & exhaust port attached: I use the scoop to dump in the beans through the open ended handle into the exhaust port. By the way, the scoop is pretty cool because of the open handle, but also because it has a flattened bottom so prevent any type of roll. Its flat bottom let's me use it on the scale.

forum.homeroasters.org/forum/attachments/scoop-post.jpg

To discharge the beans: Loosen the tri-clamp that is below the screen (see pic below). Use silicon gloves to handle the hot roast chamber metal and roast chamber extension/exhaust port. If I want, I can take off the roast chamber extension with the exhaust port by removing one tri-clamp. I then tilt the chamber to release the beans.

I am plenty capable, so there is no issue. If I start roasting 10 hours straight, I would come up with another more streamlined solution. Besides, this is Mark I. Mark II will have improvements. Still learning....

I've been watching this thread for dumping inspiration:https://forum.homeroasters.org/forum/...post_70758


forum.homeroasters.org/forum/attachments/bean_discharge-post.jpg
jbrux4 attached the following images:
bean_discharge-post.jpg scoop-post.jpg

Edited by jbrux4 on 03/28/2020 6:06 PM
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
The trek towards a cyclone chaff collector has begun. I am waiting on pieces and parts to connect it all together. I decided on a mason jar lid to attach directly to the cyclone with J-B Weld so that I can screw a jar on and off.

All I was thinking when trying to come up with a method to attach the lid was surface area. Maximize the surface area for the lid to grab on to the epoxy and cyclone with. So, I snipped along the inner circumference of the lid and alternated the bending of the tabs - up then down. I applied the epoxy to the tabs and along the mating line on the cyclone. I then pressed the lid into place. It holds extremely well. I have no fears of the lid losing anchor.

In addition, I got a little cheap cart that will fit the electronics enclosure and the roaster.

It is coming along. I kind of got forced into figuring out the chaff collection because my extension cords aren't long enough to get the roaster to the outside of the garage. I was lucky enough to get two GFCI outlets on separate 20A circuits in the garage. Since it is the safest approach, I don't want to try my luck anywhere else.

Temperature readings are a nightmare. No point in charting inaccuracies. However, I know that the full capabilities of the TC4 and Artisan won't get realized until I do start charting with accurate readings. I do have a really good feel for the roaster and the stages that beans take through the course of roasting. I am to the point where I can play with the roast. I have plenty of beans on hand, so I am trying different things.

I did my largest roast of 19 oz (539g). which netted a little over 16 oz. (453g). I will keep pushing it and playing around.
jbrux4 attached the following images:
cyclone3-post.jpg cyclone2-post.jpg cyclone1-post.jpg cart1-post.jpg

R/
Jared
 
renatoa
My quick (and dirty Grin ) solution was to use a hot cup silicone sleeve, as a seal fitting directly into the jar mouth.
renatoa attached the following image:
whatsapp_image_2020-04-11_at_124055.jpeg
 
jbrux4

Quote

renatoa wrote:

My quick (and dirty Grin ) solution was to use a hot cup silicone sleeve, as a seal fitting directly into the jar mouth.


It is quick and dirty, but seems like you have it resting on a table as well. Mine will be suspended in air, so I needed to have a more secure solution. I do like your method though.
R/
Jared
 
CK
Here's a new one I've designed that is similar to Jared's. This is not high temp PLA yet, but rather a proof of concept that works well. It has a custom high temp gasket that makes the system airtight.
CK attached the following image:
chaff_cyclone_attachment.jpg
 
jbrux4

Quote

CK wrote:

Here's a new one I've designed that is similar to Jared's. This is not high temp PLA yet, but rather a proof of concept that works well. It has a custom high temp gasket that makes the system airtight.


CK,

Ohhhh man that is nice. That 3D printing not only solves functional issues, it solves them in form as well.
R/
Jared
 
CK

Quote

That 3D printing not only solves functional issues, it solves them in form as well.


Tip:

I added the red extension piece (a performance improvement) because I’ve found if the bottom of the chaff container is too close to the bottom of the metal cyclone, too many chaff fragments escape the exhaust.
 
jbrux4

Quote

CK wrote:

Quote

That 3D printing not only solves functional issues, it solves them in form as well.


Tip:

I added the red extension piece (a performance improvement) because I’ve found if the bottom of the chaff container is too close to the bottom of the metal cyclone, too many chaff fragments escape the exhaust.


I'll see how mine goes. I do have the option of using a wide mouth jar to move farther up the cyclone. The epoxy is easy to remove - just use a heat gun to heat it up - I set mine at 800 - and it flakes off. I'll cross that bridge later if needed.

Thanks for the tip!!
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4
Cyclone chaff collector test is a success from the perspective of collecting chaff. I didn't notice anything escaping. I roasted 16 oz. of Yirgacheffe for this.

However, from the perspective of roasting by sight, smell, and sound - the sound factor has been diminished greatly. Overall, the roast was extremely muffled. This means I can't hear cracks unless I focus and really try to listen for them. Before, when there was an "open end" to the system, the cracks were prominent. If I don't pay attention, I will miss it. One might say it is easy to just focus and listen, but focusing on temp or airflow can easily take me away from listening for just a bit, and that bit just may be 2nd crack getting underway or rapidly progressing without my awareness.

This makes the need for accurate temps more of a necessity. However, the cost and work in trying to do so just isn't in my cards right now. My next action will be to split the heat pipe into two separate pieces with each piece having its own element. I will also think about a bean dump or charge of some sort.

Here's a couple vids of the chaff collector in action.

Early in the roast:


Late in the roast:

R/
Jared
 
renatoa
More than accurate temp, rather focus on differentials / jumps, they tell you FC start better than sound.
Check attached pic, in this roast, because I am partially hearing-impaired, my ears hear the first sounds at 204 C, but that jump at 200 tell me a lot better that endothermic reaction started. i.e. first crack Grin
renatoa attached the following image:
20-04-10_1233_el_salvador_finca_los_pirineos_bourbon_272g_2.png

Edited by renatoa on 04/17/2020 4:00 AM
 
pisanoal

Quote

renatoa wrote:

More than accurate temp, rather focus on differentials / jumps, they tell you FC start better than sound.
Check attached pic, in this roast, because I am partially hearing-impaired, my ears hear the first sounds at 204 C, but that jump at 200 tell me a lot better that endothermic reaction started. i.e. first crack Grin


Good advice. One possible drawback to this is not all roasters/beans have a distinct "flick" at the start of FC. There also isn't a distinct change at 2C that i am aware of? Generally speaking, i get a slight leveling off and sometimes an actual flick right before FC, then towards the end, my ROR will start to try to go back up. I'm not as familiar with start of 2C as i don't roast that far generally.

Another possibility that i had to do with a sealed roaster i built was open the top up for the first roast of a new type of bean (or after making changes that affect your BT reading) so i could hear the cracks better and log where FC and 2C happens for that bean. Just let the chaff blow everywhere for that roast. It should be within a couple degrees each time. Then as you approach those temps on later roasts with that bean, you can listen more intently for the cracks, and look for the clues renatoa was speaking of.
 
jbrux4

Quote

renatoa wrote:

More than accurate temp, rather focus on differentials / jumps, they tell you FC start better than sound.
Check attached pic, in this roast, because I am partially hearing-impaired, my ears hear the first sounds at 204 C, but that jump at 200 tell me a lot better that endothermic reaction started. i.e. first crack Grin


I am trying to see the jump, but all I see is a gradual increase. I do not understand how you are seeing FC with that gradual of an increase. I do understand the point you are making though. I need to understand this, so perhaps provide additional points to consider with your example...
R/
Jared
 
jbrux4

Quote

pisanoal wrote:

Good advice. One possible drawback to this is not all roasters/beans have a distinct "flick" at the start of FC. There also isn't a distinct change at 2C that i am aware of? Generally speaking, i get a slight leveling off and sometimes an actual flick right before FC, then towards the end, my ROR will start to try to go back up. I'm not as familiar with start of 2C as i don't roast that far generally.

Another possibility that i had to do with a sealed roaster i built was open the top up for the first roast of a new type of bean (or after making changes that affect your BT reading) so i could hear the cracks better and log where FC and 2C happens for that bean. Just let the chaff blow everywhere for that roast. It should be within a couple degrees each time. Then as you approach those temps on later roasts with that bean, you can listen more intently for the cracks, and look for the clues renatoa was speaking of.


I used 2C as an example because it isn't as loud and it can come on quickly with rapid progression depending on the bean - the Indonesian Sumatra comes to mind with a quick onset and rapid progression of 2C. I do like to develop some roasts to the verge of 2C and then perform a rapid cooling. That is neither here nor there - the point is that any crack is muffled. I became so tuned into the cracks and their start and stop to determine roast progression, my roasting prowess has diminished along with the sound. I have to relearn the system.

The dynamic of the roaster has changed with the addition of the chaff collector because it creates more back pressure. Back pressure, in my system, means better heat development from the elements and a "hotter" roast chamber. I need to find the balance again. The Yirg roasted quicker with the chaff collector in my test. Your example of opening the system to hear cracks and focusing on the "registered" BT at cracks is independent of back pressure - so this is a good recommendation that I will follow through with. Independent because the additional back pressure deals with element heat output and the hotter roast chamber affects the time for bean development through stages. I need to focus on the registered temp and then try to get to those temps according to a profile with the chaff collector then attached. Temperature is temperature - how quick you get there is determined by the roaster - whether that is Artisan/TC4 or me.
R/
Jared
 
renatoa

Quote

jbrux4 wrote:

I am trying to see the jump, but all I see is a gradual increase. I do not understand how you are seeing FC with that gradual of an increase. I do understand the point you are making though. I need to understand this, so perhaps provide additional points to consider with your example...


In real ... er, roast, Grin is not that gradual, it happens quick, and is really easy to detect that bump.
To be more clear, I am not roasting with tethered Artisan, but TC4 only, and my eyes are on TC4 screen. I don't watch the bump to happen on the graph, but in values evolution.
In those moments all you want to see is a continuous declining RoR, having as goal the value 6-7 C degrees when entering FC. It's very easy to notice a change in trend, for example when I am at RoR 7 waiting to see the change down to 6, an opposite direction change, to value 8, is an instant bell ring. It's quick, not lasting more than 10 seconds, and you see the RoR fall to the expected 6 value, and continue to decrease.
THAT is crack, the exhaust of vapors from the first beans. !

Unfortunately, this not work for 2nd crack, and I can't give you any advice, I am a light roasting man, not even finishing FC.
 
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