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Homeroasters.org » DATALOGGERS - CONTROLLERS - RATE OF RISE METERS » Dataloggers/Controllers/Rate of Rise Meters
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Logger and controls for Ambex YM-2
bigote
Exactly as you put it, green,blue,purple wires go to the rheostat in from of the box and the 2 wires red/black go to the valve directly.
The other 2 wires in the back of the board are 24VAC coming from the transformer.

good day Stan
 
boar_d_laze
If there's still a question, Maxitrol identifies the M420RH valve as "modulated" in the product specifications.

BDL
USRC 1lb Roaster, Chemex+Kone, Espro, Various FPs, Royal Siphon Vacuum, Yama Ice Drip Tower, Bunnzilla, La Cimbali M21 Casa, Ceado E92.
CookFoodGood
 
allenb
I spoke with the folks at Maxitrol today and asked several questions as to mode of operation and several others not addressed in their spec sheets. Here's what I found:

When an input 0-10 or 4-20 mA varies it's output to the SC11 interface board from min to max, the SC11 sends a variable 0 - 20 vdc to the valve. From 0 to 5 vdc the valve is in "low fire" which is allowing a user adjustable bypass flow of gas around the valve through a port that only stays engaged up to 5 vdc. This is for making sure your burner never gets less gas flow than will keep it running at a stable burn.

From 5 v to 15 v the valve leaves the low fire bypass mode and modulates like a normal proportional valve. As long as your input signal keeps the SC11 sending a proportional signal between 5 and 15 V then the valve continues to modulate to maintain setpoint. If the input signal increases further causing the SC11 to go beyond 15 V then the valve jumps into a second bypass mode which is "high fire" and will stay there as long as the output from the SC11 is anywhere between 15 and 20 volts. High fire flow rate is also user adjustable. If I remember correctly, the high fire bypass mode requires the use of an external regulator to set the flow rate. Also needed in the chain is a gas solenoid valve (on-off) for starting and stopping burner operation.

There's a lot more going on here than I was imagining when first looking over this burner arrangement and I'm not sure that there would be a way to easily and safely replace your PID controls with the TC4 and driver board unless we had an absolutely clear picture of what you have for input and safety controls now. If you can get us more info of all components in the chain and how they interact it's possible we can figure out a way to make it happen.

Some additional info I got from the staff:

- The SC11 does not accept PWM and nor does the valve
- Opening and closing of the valve is instantaneous (milliseconds)
- No hysteresis going from opening direction to closing direction
- Input resistance to SC11 is very high so around 1 mA input current.
- I couldn't get input voltage to valve coil current data from them.

Allen
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
bigote
Great job Allen on digging for more info on this valve.
I forgot to mention that the PID has no connection to the M420 but instead is hooked to the honeywell regulator/valve (don't know what it is) located just before the 420 on the 1/2 inch pipe other than that it has the input from the TC and an output to the buzzer alarm, no connection the the 211 or the valve at all.
thank you and good nite.
 
rustic_roaster
Allen,

Good thing you called the vendor, dont think that information you mentioned is in the datasheets. By not releasing information about the valve it seems they are trying to protect sales of their converters.

I wonder if the controller that Luis is using is really like the SC11. It seems like a pot connected to a SC11 would only give adjustments in the middle range and have large areas at the ends that made no adjustment.

Seems sort of funny that the flame adjustment is outside of the PID controller loop. You think the PID is being used to provide temp info and provide safety control of the gas supply?
 
allenb
Stan wrote:

You think the PID is being used to provide temp info and provide safety control of the gas supply?

Not sure at all. I'm very curious though and it will be interesting to find out how the whole thing ties together.

After hearing about how this valve works I'm pretty impressed with it. It also seems to be pretty beefy and not having any hysteresis is a big plus.

Allen
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
bigote
Hi guys, I just found this other thread which might shed some more light as how this roaster operates.
http://billgiffen....php?t=109
I hope I'm not breaking any rules here...
Here is another YM-2 with running profile software
http://shakinjake...ambex.html

P.S. Just had my 120 Gal. propane thank filled today, just need a new regulator since the one that came with the machine is for portable tank only.

Regards
Edited by bigote on 08-13-2013 18:45
 
scareyourpassenger
I may be going down this path as well. Just got a um-2 and would like a bit more control over the final stages of roasting. A less drastic ramp on smaller loads.

The Honeywell is the safety control and looks like it just take a simple on and off switch to open the valve and light.
The manual is here http://vancontrols.com/pdf/hw/sv9601_i_i.pdf

I think the real question is if the m420 can drop the temps low enough or if a complete on and off via the honeywell is required for proper profiling.
 
allenb
scareyourpassenger wrote:

I think the real question is if the m420 can drop the temps low enough or if a complete on and off via the honeywell is required for proper profiling.


From what I was reading and hearing from the Maxitrol folks, using the bypass port, you should be able to set the low fire rate down as low as you need as long as you don't drop to the point where the flame becomes unstable and goes out. Have you tried finding the burner's minimum firing rate by dialing it back till it won't stay lit?

Allen
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
scareyourpassenger
allenb wrote:

scareyourpassenger wrote:

I think the real question is if the m420 can drop the temps low enough or if a complete on and off via the honeywell is required for proper profiling.


From what I was reading and hearing from the Maxitrol folks, using the bypass port, you should be able to set the low fire rate down as low as you need as long as you don't drop to the point where the flame becomes unstable and goes out. Have you tried finding the burner's minimum firing rate by dialing it back till it won't stay lit?

Allen


Not yet but I plan to. I have an Arduino and tc4 but since none of the outputs will work from controlling the Maxitrol I may have to save up for a Fuji PID.
 
scareyourpassenger
Hmm, I didn't even think about it but I bet his would work using a digital pot. I need to get a screen for the Arduino now:)

It also looks like the Honeywell regulator is used to adjust the high setting and the Maxitrol can be adjusted for the low setting. It may require some experimenting but the flame might be low enough to leave on all the time vs the on and off control on it now.
 
CoffeeGeek786
Well you'll be happy to know that I got the link to the site that can help you out with this: http://www.roasterdynamics.com/RoasterDynamics/Our_Services.html

they are more experienced and equipped in the matter to deal with your problem. good luck.
Yasar Pervaiz
Chief Editor @ http://espressogu...
 
http://espressogurus.com/
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